A NEW JUSTICE Ivo Josipovic feels that finding a way out of the economic crisis and winning the war on corruption and crime are necessary to bring optimism back to CroatiaIvo Josipovic is the new President of Croatia. On Sunday 10 January he won a convincing victory over Milan Bandic and took the majority of the vote in all parts of the country with the exception of the Lika region (where the difference, apropos, was minimal in favour of the other candidate). And thus he completed a campaign launched exactly 12 months ago, when in January of 2009 he announced he would make a bid for the SDP nomination for the presidency. Few then believed he would win, with the explanation of the others that Josipovic, with his quiet style and appearances was not interesting to voters. Even some SDP members believed that it would be better to find another candidate, but Zlatko Komadina turned down the offer, while Ljubo Jurcic was defeated at the party caucuses. And so Josipovic was left on the scene and launched his campaign in mid summer.

Now he is the winner, and he faces, as does Croatia, great challenges. In spite of the limitations of the presidential office in creating economic policy, the public expects Josipovic to make a contribution to getting out of the recession. It will be very important, therefore, how much he will work on an economic recovery and in what measure he will cooperate with the Government led by Jadranka Kosor. The second challenge is to wind up the negotiations with the European Union and co-create foreign policy, in which the President plays an important role.

Ivo Josipovic has given his first interview as the President-elect to Nacional and in it outlined the policies he will lead over the coming five years.

Improving political culture

NACIONAL: What needs to be done in Croatia?
- What this country needs is optimism. And that is possible only if we succeed in showing good results in the war on corruption and crime, and show that there is a way out of the economic crisis. It is important that people believe that we are heading in the right direction. My concept of a new justice requires that everyone be able to earn a decent living. On this route we have to take the first steps this year. The President does not have direct competences in the economy, but in the frame of the third basket of his authorities he can launch initiatives, and if you like, put pressure on Government to encourage better solutions. Above all I intend to sit down and talk with Prime Minister Jadranka Kosor to see what Government's plans are in the area of economic policy. For now it appears that Government has yet to find a way out of this crisis. I will gather a team of people who understand and live for the economy, to see how to reorient today's import-heavy economy into an export economy. We have to see in what aspects we are better than others and work on that. This ties in to my desire to work on a shift in the political culture in Croatia, because what is dominant today is an old-fashioned form of political communication. We need to look to democracies that are much more open to debates between those in power, the opposition and the public. I would like to have something here like the American concept of a think tank, where there is permanent discussion that leads to interesting solutions. I would like to introduce this kind of political culture to Croatia.

NACIONAL: How do you think Croatia will look in five years time?
- I would like to see Croatia find a way out of the economic crisis over the coming five years and that it reaffirms itself in the war on corruption. During this period we will certainly accede to the European Union. I would like Croatia, even though it is a small country, to not lose its national identity and distinctness in this environment. I believe that we will have a solid economy and a good political system that will not allow figures you can connect with corruption, theft or plunder to be found at key posts from the local to the national level. And I am not talking about the political right or left here, this party or that, but of a fundamental criteria based on which someone without a clean past has no place in politics. All those who have stolen or done something immoral must be recognised as unsuitable for public office. Along with this I would like to see our country recognised for its possible comparative advantages, and that is what we are referring to as the blue and green Croatia - tourism and agriculture. I would also like Croatia to turn to re-industrialisation instead of, as has been the case so far, to imports. Foreign investment should be present not only in purchasing existing resources, but also in completely new economic projects.

NACIONAL: Perhaps you will be censured as being opposed to foreign capital?
- Not at all, but I think that it would be much better for Greenfield investments to come to Croatia. In principle it is all the same whose capital is at issue, but I want it to create new jobs and not, as is often the case, that many people, after a change of ownership, find themselves out of a job, often without severance pay.

How to facilitate accession to the European Union

NACIONAL: What will you do if the representatives of Audi or Ikea come asking for your help?
- We need to be realistic. Negotiations on opening companies are not within the competences of the president. I would, however, recommend to Government, i.e. the Ministry of the Economy, steps needed to attract foreign investment. At the political level I will certainly back these kinds of projects.

NACIONAL: I assume that it is a good feeling to know that you will be the President that will take Croatia into the European Union.
- Of course I am very happy about that. It will be a very important step for our country. Figuratively speaking, I would like Europe to also enter Croatia, especially with its values such as democracy and human rights. The interest of people for accession to the EU is threatened by the economic crisis from which many families are suffering, and in a way it also leads Croatia to the temptation of euro-scepticism, a fear that all of our resources will be bought up by foreigners. Just getting into the EU is not the only important thing - and I do believe that we will become a member of the Union on 1 January 2012 - but also to enter prepared for the merciless European Union market. We have to develop economically. It is important that we remain socially sensitive, show solidarity, during that development. That means that we will also have to care for those who will have it hardest, so that we might experience accession to the EU as a societal step forward.

NACIONAL: What social strata do you feel will be most threatened by accession to the EU?
- During the election campaign, especially in Slavonia, I saw many social groups on the verge of poverty. These are, above all, people in their forties; the companies they worked for have folded, they are too young for retirement, and too old for retraining. The second threatened group are farmers, especially the owners of small rural homesteads, who are increasingly impoverished, and whose farms are failing. The third are pensioners and the disabled, because many of them have scandalously low incomes. Those are, as I see it, the three most threatened groups in the Croatian population, irrespective of the EU.

NACIONAL: When you mention farmers, will you support one of the conditions for accession to the EU, and that is the possibility that foreigners buy land and real estate in Croatia without limitation?
A NIGHT OF CELEBRATION Ivo Josipovic celebrated his election triumph with his wife Tatjana and daughter Lana, with whom he otherwise very rarely appears in public as he keeps his private life discrete- Although the decision on this is made by Parliament, I will advocate a solution that will not mean a complete abandonment of national resources. Besides, it is an open question what direction the EU will develop towards in the future. It's wrong to say that we do not want foreign investment, but the most important thing is that our farmers manage to hold on to their land and increase the size of their holdings, because that is the only way for them to be competitive. Above all we have to help out our people, because I saw many examples of the abuse of subsidies in Slavonia, and almost nothing is produced. Some tycoons have brought up large landholdings and, although they produce almost nothing, receive massive subsidies. On the other hand farmers are paid subsidies in the form of coupons. Foreign capital is sure to enter our agricultural sector, but we have to give thought to how to protect Croatian farmers.

NACIONAL: When it comes to the economy, the employers feel that labour in Croatia has overly extensive rights and that this shackles the development of the economy. What is your opinion?
- Business people often cite rights that exist in some European countries and feel that they are in a less favourable position here. On the other hand, the unions also do not want to abandon some acquired rights. In this case I would stand on the side of labour, because the practices in many companies show that laws are not at all abided by, and that protection of worker rights is poor or non-existent. That is the cause of the opposition to the reduction of rights, because people are thinking - if the employers are now doing what they are doing, what is it going to look like if these rights are further reduced? The redistribution of rights will be possible when there is a fair relationship between labour and capital and when people are not fired on a whim, only because some owners are piling up their wealth. An example of an unfair relationship is the work of employees in some retail companies. Legal provisions concerning working hours and labour subject to special pay. The worst of it is that it is all written in the labour law, but no one abides by it. That is why I understand the unions who feel that why should we abandon some of our rights when no one respects even the ones we have. We will have to build trust, just like the labour market, in which no one will live in fear that, if you change or lose your job, you will never find new employment again. I will advocate trust and a labour market that will ensure flexibility so that everyone can find a job, with full respect of labour rights.

The judiciary and politics

NACIONAL: How do you see the development of the European Union in the future?
- The basic question for the moment is whether the EU will continue to strengthen supranational institutions and move towards a model similar to the structure of the United States of America, or preserve the existing framework. I think that at his point in time no one can forecast with certainty how things will develop in the Union. This was evident during the negotiations on the Lisbon Treaty. There are various schools of thought, but the most important thing is that there must not be a forced strengthening of European government. Whatever direction the European Union does develop in, Croatia must secure its own distinct place and the distinctness of the Croatian nation and culture within it. I am not referring here only to Croatians, but rather to all our minorities, who are a contribution to the societal life of Croatia.

NACIONAL: Which concept do you have a greater affinity for - a confederative or a more closely bound European Union?
- That depends on how the situation will develop. Croatia is a small country and we will certainly not have the influence of a France or Germany. That is why it is important to develop criteria that will also guarantee a good place for small nations in the Union, and not that they feel that others are imposing their views on them. That means that we have to have a dose of realism, and a dose of equitability, which I bring into connection with the tradition of our distinctness, culture and economic strength, which will have to be much greater than it presently is.

NACIONAL: As a professor of law what do you think the rulings on the Croatian generals at the Hague tribunal will be?
- Do not ask me that because the trails are still ongoing. I wish each one of them success in these trials, but have no wish to speculate on how the tribunal will rule.

NACIONAL: I ask because you are certainly aware that a great majority of the Croatian public feels that politics have a significant influence on the UN International Criminal Tribunal for the former Yugoslavia in The Hague.
- Let's not have any illusions, the judiciary is the other side of politics. In countries in which the rule of law functions politics influences the adoption of laws, but there should be no direct political influence on concrete judicial proceedings. I have worked long on the issue of the tribunal in The Hague and I believe it brings progress in the development of democratic standards. Croatia would be a significantly different place if we had not adopted some of the standards of the ICTY. Far from it that there have not been things at the Hague tribunal that, from the legal aspect, were not very good, but in spite of these weaknesses I do not regret the fact that there is a Hague tribunal. In our desire to take over some Hague cases we have improved the standards at Croatian courts and I am proud to have helped in the education of our judges, and was the author of the law that provided for the transfer of these cases to Croatian courts. As long as we are on the subject, the ICTY has charged three Croatian generals, and there are a total of 161 defendants there. At least at the quantitative level it can hardly be said that the Hague tribunal is leading an anti-Croatian policy.

NACIONAL: In your opinion is strategic partnership more important with Brussels or Washington?
- Croatia wants to accede to the EU and by the nature of things Europe is our primary goal. On the other hand the United States are a long time and sincere friend to Croatia and membership in the Union cannot prevent us from also developing the firmest possible relations with the USA. I think that the question of EU or USA is a false dilemma, all the more so because we have to bear in mind above all our own national interests. And it is precisely national interests that will decide whether we will lean more towards America or Europe in a given situation, but, all in all, the situation is as it is - we are a part of Europe, and we have an excellent friend in America.

ON THE BIG EUROPEAN MARKET

NACIONAL: What are Croatia's foreign policy interests?
- Above all that Croatia fits into the European Union to the best of its interests. That means that we have to be capable of successfully competing on that market, and to preserve our national identity in the process. What is important is the national interest and national security and I want to make sure that no one will ever attack Croatia again. Economic development is an important facet of the national interest, as is social development, which includes reaffirming human rights and democratic standards.

NACIONAL: When speaking of large countries, are you concerned by the strengthening of Russian influence in the Balkans?
IVO JOSIPOVIC with his colleagues from the SDP- I am not afraid. As much as we are, as a member of NATO, and soon also of the European Union, a part of the western hemisphere, I think it would be completely insane not to develop good relations with Russia, China and India. They too have capital, you can do trade with them normally, and that means the best possible relations with these major countries, while keeping the strategic interest in mind, and that is our affiliation with Europe.

NACIONAL: How do you see relations between Croatia and Serbia developing in the future?
- The relations are tense at the moment, but I would like to point out that, after accession to the EU, relations with neighbours is my strategic interest. Our security depends on good relations with our neighbours and stability in the region, just like our economy depends on good relations and commerce with neighbouring countries. We have an exceedingly positive economic balance only with Bosnia & Herzegovina, and it is an open question how we are going to pay off our debt if we are not more present on neighbouring and new markets. The time of joint projects is certainly coming. There must be an end to the fear of neighbours that people have as a result of the war and aggression waged against us. This does not mean any kind of new integration and the ideas of some kind of new Yugoslavia are quite immaterial. There is no new Yugoslavia and there will never be one ever again. But there are neighbouring countries with which we need to be friends, do trade with and build good relations with. In building our mutual relations we have to keep in mind that we will in a few years time, together with Serbia, Bosnia & Herzegovina, Montenegro and Slovenia, be members of a supranational European Union.

Looking to quality immigration

NACIONAL: The war on terror is now almost in its tenth year. Do you consider Islam a threat to democracy?
- Islam is not a threat to democracy; it is a faith that should be respected. Terrorism is the wrong answer to some unjust relationships in the current world order. It brings no good above all to those communities that feel that these relations should be different, and are harmful to the overall global community. It is harmful to the development of the countries from which people engaged in terrorism come from and that is why the broadest possible alliance has to be created against terrorism, but at the same time we have to redefine some aspects of the current world order.

NACIONAL: As the Commander in Chief how will you react to a possible request for Croatian Army troops to be deployed in dangerous military missions?
- I will apply very rational criteria in those kinds of situations. The first criterion is whether we have enough trained and equipped soldiers whose security is at the highest level. I will evaluate the level of risk involved in sending our troops into dangerous war zones. One needs to assess the global national interest, i.e. whether taking part in an operation could, in the global sense, hurt Croatia. And finally, our participation has to be base on proportionality. The participation of the Croatian Army has to be in proportion to its size and our economic strength. Those are the criteria based on which one needs to decide whether or not to participate in a military operation.

NACIONAL: What if, for example, the US where to request that Croatian troops stay in Afghanistan, while some other countries withdraw their contingents?
- National interest always comes first, and then cooperation with partners.

NACIONAL: When it becomes a member of the European Union, Croatia will probably have to face immigration. Can the arrival of foreigners cause problems?
- I think there is nothing to fear here. We have a territory on which 4 and a half million people live, while 50 million could easily live on it. There will be immigrants and it is in our interest that it be a good immigration of people that will help make things better for us all. Besides, even as far back as during the Austro-Hungarian empire minorities like the Czechs and Slovaks made significant contributions to the development of Croatia. I am more afraid of our people going off to somewhere else than I am that immigrants might come here. I am convinced that our culture and identity will be preserved.